Facebook Etiquette

I want to touch on a little Facebook etiquette. Its not written anywhere and Facebook being such an emerging marketing tool, there are just some things we either do not think about, or doing so in my opinion in an unethical way. As true professionals, I believe we should hold ourselves to very high ideals.

I have my personal facebook page and I use that mainly for personal stuff. I post a lot on there. On my business page, it is 100% business. I post 1-2x's a day max to keep it active, yet not be annoying. I want interaction. I want interaction with people who want to hire me at some point the most though lol. I comment on other photographers photos when I really like them, and others comment on mine. Which, I love.

This brings me to the point of this huge post. My pet peeve. When another photographer posts on my page AS THEIR BUSINESS PAGE LOOKING FOR BUSINESS COVERTLY. This is marketing on my advertising. Like walking into my studio, commenting on my photos on the wall and handing the client a business card of your own. Even worse, when they post a link to their page and say "Like me and I'll like you back!"

I don't think its something usually done on purpose(sometimes it is, often it is not) But, its something to think about. If you are a regular personal account you are posting as YOU. If you are a page, you are posting as your business, with the ability to go right back to your BUSINESS PAGE.

Its food for thought and often we don't think of something until its brought to ones attention. I find it very disrespectful. I will pull those posts from my page fairly often depending on my mood and what I think the motive is behind it. I had one person yell at me(figuratively speaking) via email and say she was taught to do that sort of marketing on a forum. Nice tactic. Probably why it is such a pet peeve of mine. Note the pun lol

This just happens to me so often, and its just so terribly RUDE that it is something to be cognizant of.

http://www.rocktheshotforum.com/2011/09/16/facebook-etiquette-for-photographers/

Julie,
the problem with broad-reach, "free" media is that there are no rules. It's kinda like stealing images off of websites: if you can do it than it's OK to do it. We tend to assume that all people who are in business understand fundamental business ethics. And we are reminded just how wrong we are almost every day.

Perhaps it's time for those Social Media gurus to add ethics into their seminars and forums. That, of course, would pre-suppose that they actually know what they are. Hate to be so negative but that sort of behavior is not surprising. On the other hand, cross-promotion of symbiotic businesses on your Facebook pages is actually a pretty good idea so where do you draw the line?

Jim

Of course there are rules. They don't have to be laws made by the government to be rules. I wouldn't walk up to a stranger and say 'you smell'. Why, because its RUDE. I am protected by free speech to be able to do so, but, that doesn't mean it is OK.

Its a good idea ONLY if it is mutually agreed upon. Would you be ok with me coming onto your facebook announcing I was going to be in FL for the dog show circuit and to give me a call if they wanted candids? OF COURSE NOT. I wouldn't do it because a) its incredibly unethical and b) its beyond rude.

This is not rocket science. This shouldn't NEED teaching, but, it obviously does.

Unfortunately there are some forums out there promoting this as a great way to market.

Julie,
has anybody mentioned that you tend to argue with yourself? What you think is rude and unethical may not be seen that way by others who do not have your background, both business and personal. And the fact that folks are using your business' Facebook page to promote their own "businesses" proves that:
a. they simply don't get it
b. they simply think it's OK
or
c. they've been told that it's OK.

So, obviously, the rules DO need to be posted and understood and folks have to agree to them.

Now, if you were coming to FL and wanted to shoot ring candids I would expect you to email me so I could join you. If I announce on my Facebook page that I'm available for ring candids, it is because I've already discussed it with the Show Chairs/Vendor Chairs and we've come to an agreement. Sometimes that means I have to pay a reduced vendor fee. I'm probably the only one taking candids that has approached it this way. And I don't shoot on spec. I only shoot clients. I don't assume to have rights I don't have and I know you don't either. And as difficult as it is to get consensus on the etiquette of that, it is doubly difficult in a medium that has very little history behind it and, generally-speaking, no rules. Rude is very much within the accepted genre of Facebook, Twitter, etc.

This is not rocket science but the folks involved are not rocket scientists. This is the digital age. Whatever I can do is OK simply because I can do it. I understand and respect your frustration. And I think there will have to be some education involved so folks can, in fact, learn what is and is not appropriate. Oh, and I can tell you that you smell because I'm an honest and candid person . That's how some very rude people see themselves.

Jim

As a rule, I can argue both sides of most subjects. This one though, I just fall on the *its rude* and really ballsy. Shooting ringside candids can fall into a gray area, marketing yourself on someone else's business page is pretty clear. You are using their fan base to better yourself without doing the hard work.

The only reason we know not to go up to people and say rude things is that we've been told to. Kids do it when they haven't encountered a given situation. And it is facebook that makes the rules for their site. You can delete or block people and businesses that do it, and tell them you think it's rude, but it may or may not stop them from spamming other pages.
Oni

I think the that it's a lot like real life... Peer pressure plays a big role in governing how people act in general. I personally see a lot more community governance on Google+ than I have seen on FB.

Unfortunately, the people promoting how to build fan pages are the very ones encouraging the behavior of posting on other's pages. Personally, I think there is a place for posting as a business, but that is when offering valuable info or content to another page that could be a customer. It really really looks unprofessional to post on a competitor's page.

Sure, if I bought actions from a photographer, its GOOD practice to go to that page and say "I love your awesome actions" as your page. That shows that real photographers use and love them

To post "I love your pictures like me back" well, that is just not right. If your page is named XYZ photograph I shoot dogs, kids and everything and clicking on that name takes you to their page, that is covert marketing using someone else's fan base and its rude.

Just because the internet was invented, does not excuse one of common courtesy. I mean really, would you walk into someone's studio and put your cards on their wall portraits and leave? Would you put a sign on their front window? Of course not. What is the difference of doing that and posting on someone's business page?

Yall remind me of our Congress. Even when you agree, it seems to be contentious.

Can we start a list? If people are not rude but simply uneducated then it might help.

Julie's peeve is my number one: Don't post to other Photographers business Page with your business page identity. In my opinion it is also bad form to post to their personal page as your business identity.

I'd like to add another one: Don't tag another Photographer with one of your photos unless they are in the photo.

Any others?

I get tagged sooooo much, I have set it up where I have to approve any tags and if I don't want it on the wall at all, I don't approve it. I don't think people know when I don't.

I have had mine set up that way since Timeline and I really had no idea how many people were tagging me because I don't look at my own profile that much.

Yeah Julie, the photographers obsessively liking other photographers just to have more likes is kinda dumb. I mean, it's pretty pointless as they aren't your market and aren't going to be your customers. I do like a lot of photographers pages-but only because I actually like to look at their work (or we're related lol) not because I went on a binge of trading likes.
Oni

I like some photographers pages for the same reason. They are inspiring. I don't like pages just because I am asked to, because, its kinda pointless. Other photographers aren't going to make you any money or bring you any clients unless you are selling goods TO them.

I think its fine for other photographers to like my page, or comment on it, but, really, we do know when we are being subversive and when we are genuine.

Julie,
so are you saying that if I "like" one of your images -- or Preston's or Jim Poor's or anybody else's -- that it doesn't mean anything because you can't count on my giving you any business? I'm sorry. I thought there was a difference between genuine peer appreciation and simply wanting comments from folks who can help you financially.

Now, before you go into orbit, I know you comment on my images -- and other photographers that you know -- because you truly like the image. And it means more to me than having somebody who knows nothing about how that image was created liking it.

I'm not competing with you. I'd be far more likely to collaborate with you. So, if I like your images, it's because I truly like your images. I'm a photographer. I have a right to like. I hope you value my opinions as much as I value yours.

Jim

There are several reasons why having other photographers as "likes" is not necessarily "pointless." Consider the photographer that offers workshops or sells actions... that photographer's customers are other photographers. Also, for some of the "bigger names" numbers are important. Want a sponsership from a manufacturer or software developer, they want numbers (and they're no interested in folks looking to have some pretty pictures made for them). So depending on ones business model and "stature" in the industry it's not necessarily a pointless excercise.

It's also worth noting that prospective clients what says "this photographer is talented" better than a positive comment by another photographer? A "kudos" from a non-photographer is one thing, a rave from a peer something quite more.

I would consider the Jims, Preston, James ect; friends. I have LOTS of photographer friends. Yes, we comment on each others stuff and its really nice to have the comments. I like it. I think everyone likes to hear nice things.

The reality of it is I pay my bills off of photography. I spend time working facebook to keep people wanting to spend money with me. I do like other photographers pages that I don't know and mostly, for inspiration. Occasionally I will comment on something especially moving or cool.

I see these pleas for photographers to trade likes. Beyond having more likes, there really is no benefit. I am not talking about someone selling to photographers, that is different. Also not who is asking to trade likes. It may seem like a good idea, and its really not a hurtful idea, but, it isn't gonna really help.

It is nice to have comments from your peers, and though *I* may value it more, not sure that prospective clients do. This is a emotionally driven business and what you post is what you bring to you.

Its still rude to market off of the backs of fellow photographers. If you are doing it, you know its wrong. Even if some guru said it was a great way to get new clients.

Jim,

I think you and Julie are talking about two different things. I read Julie's objection as switching to your Business identity when commenting on a post. When I compliment your work I do so as Preston Smith (which clicks through to my personal page), not as Preston Smith Photography (which clicks through to my business page).

I browse facebook as my personal profile. I do not like other photographers with my page(why would you do that?) I DO like other photographers as me(personal profile).

If Preston or someone else posted to my page as their page, I would know that they weren't trying to market off my page because *I know them*.

If its a stranger, I don't know that. If you post a link to my wall saying "like me" I will delete and ban you. Seriously. If you post as your page and I don't know you, I will bristle but if otherwise are nice and seem genuine, I will let it go and give the benefit of the doubt.