Lightroom vs CS5

Hi all. I need the collective wisdom and advice. I have a couple new computers 64 bit, so I HAVE to upgrade to CS5 on these. No problem, but the 30% off lightroom is calling my name. I like it, but the $$$ sheesh. I have lived without this long, bridge works ok but what do you all say?

Someone must have these both?

I have them both and still use CS5 and Bridge 90% of the time. Probably because that is what I'm most familiar with and I just haven't gotten past the learning curve with LR. I just haven't found a LR workflow that satisfies my needs.

That is interesting. I would like to hear from others- are you using another program for catolog? Are you using LR for anything?
Thank you.

Honestly, I was a huge LR fan, but lately have been using it less and less.

I only use it now for pulling several images at once to burn to disc or make a collage.

It's just to slow for the volume of images I have to be of much use in any other way for me.

Marty,
I've been using PhotoShop since version 2.0 for the Mac came out in 1991. But every time a new solution is invented I try it. I've tried versions of Aperture and of Lightroom and, for my workflow and creative needs, PS is the right answer. It's just so much more powerful than the other programs which were developed for cataloging, sorting and database management rather than image processing which is PhotoShop's forte.

I admit that, like Preston, the learning curve might have something to do with sticking with PS/CS5 but ultimately, that's where I do my final processing so that's where I start. Bridge ain't great but it works fine for me. For portrait shoots, it's plenty fast enough and for big shows like National Specialties, it's adequate. But mostly, it's integrated more closely than LR and so it works better for my workflow.

Folks have said they can do everything I do in PS in LR. I'm willing to accept that possibility but I can't do everything I do in PS in LR. And that's the key for me.

Jim

Thank you Jim! I have been reading your posts here, for a long time and I appreciate your thoughts.

My heading should have been Lightroom plus CS5, not VS CS5,
I could not do without CS5, since CS3 won't work with obvious computer upgrades, and photoshop is the bomb. Lightroom is the question- it IS a cool program, but Bridge is a cool program too, really. I would like to hear from more users PLEASE !!!

What is it that you are wanting to do? Bridge does an awful lot.

Good question-
You don't know, what you don't know. I like sorting through the images in Lightroom, for those to develop further.
(from my trials with it). I have liked being able to quickly crop and "loupe" them also. Quick, ez adjustments are good there to.
I think LR is a good solution for keeping track of various catologs, or sets of images, on a long term high volume basis. It also seems like a good solution for ez web publishing, to my Smugmug sight, but that is the question? Is it better than Bridge? Worth the money? Or just another toy?
For down to the pixel adjustment, Photoshop is definitly the bomb. Could not go without. LR, I like, but almost a duplicate to Bridge, with different templates.....????/

If I had to choose one...Photoshop would be is. Period...zip...done. With that said I have both on my computer and while LightRoom is getting easier to use, my only use for it is cataloging. Photoshop is the only tool that has ALL the tools I need. Actions are a great way to make repetitive tasks super simple.

Roman

Thank you Roman. Seems like most agree, LR is nice but maybe not that nice. Other programs, Bridge included, do the same things (Picaso comes to mind), but maybe Lightroom is slicker and also integrated well with Photoshop. I am leaning to just the upgrade for now.

I am glad that you mentioned Picasa Marty. I upload in Picasa, I find it easy to use and label. But everything else is done in Bridge and CS5. I suppose I could do everything in CS5, but old habits die hard.

Picasa is part of my workflow in finding things. I put keywords in thru Bridge and use Picasa to tell me where things are across multiple volumes.

If you haven't explored the OUTPUT portion of Bridge then you should take a look, it is easy to generate Web galleries.

Thank you everyone. This is becoming a great thread. I have experimented with Picasa but not much more. I am still not sure, what are they selling in Lightroom, that Bridge doesn't already do. Does ANYONE have anything good to say of Lightroom?

Here's one good thing I can say about Lightroom; it's a good tool for keywording and maintaining an easy accessible database of images (as long as you don't start moving things around behind the scenes, using external hard drives it can't find and the catalog doesn't get corrupt).

Can it (LR)find the photos on external drives, once re installed to the main computer?

Yes LR can find the photos on external drives once the external drive is re-installed. I haven't followed any of the new features of Lightroom 3 but I did hear that it includes support for HDSLR video.

So, you like it?

No, actually I don't really like Lightroom and I've tried to like it. I know how to use it, it just doesn't fit well with how I like to work. I use the parts of it that I like when I need it, but it's not a part of my workflow like Photoshop is. A lot of photographers like it, though, and swear by it, so it really may come down to just a personal preference.

Does any one like this LR??????? I gotta upgrade real soon................Anyone???

Sounds like you're really hoping for someone to justify a purchase for you. Why not just download the demo and try it yourself?

I have tried it- my trial ran out, and I am thinking of buying it when I upgrade to CS5 this week for two of my newer computers. I was wondering what others thought. I like it. In this months Popular Photography, Debbie Grossman gave it a great review, focus on import-export versatility and integratetion with ACR and Photoshop altogether, and noise rduction in Raw.
I sometimes shoot 100 plus shots in a day, and I usually shoot Raw. So I may go for it. I only wondered, what others use it for. It is $200 bucks with my CS5 upgrade, $300 later. I m just cheap:) wanted to know what y'all thought!

LR has the same exact noise reduction as ACR which comes free with Photoshop. The current noise reduction capability wasn't a LR advancement, it was an ACR advancement, but it sure wasn't played up that way. LR uses ACR's raw engine. It's exactly the same.

For import ease and especially speed, I prefer Photo Mechanic. I can shoot up to 10k photos in a day - always raw, and LR just can't keep up with Photo Mechanic. When it comes time to actually review the photos after import, PM blows LR out of the water by miles and miles.

PM also integrates with CS5 for external editing, but it isn't a DB program.

LR definitely has it's place, but for me that place has been becoming increasingly smaller.

My workflow is changing drasticly. I now use Photoshop CS5, the NIK Viveza, NIK Sharpener, and NIK Define noise reduction. My camera is profiled in ACR, and I have basicl 2 curves to run after I get past the Viveza.

So it is:
1. ACR (with custom camera profile)
2. Photoshop with Viveza Layer
3. Two curves
4. Save to disk.
5. Run NIK sharpener (and Define if noisy after sharpening) for print output, and save end result as ready to print.

I can then save wallpaper and web versions as needed.

Roman

Roman,

Have you tried printing while skipping the noise reduction step? I've found that unless it's just horrible, noise doesn't show in printing at all due to ink spread.

I printed a selection from 4x6 to 16x20 shot at ISO 12,800 and the noise just doesn't show.

I know. Its one of the wonderful things of printing vs. screen peeping. Define though is quite an awesome product. It has now become my defacto standard when I need noise reduction.

Roman

I imagine it's mostly because I got used to Noise Ninja first, but I never could like the interface of Define.

I should try it again someday.

Photo Mechanic looks interesting, I 'll download a trial of that. Thank you Jim. Interesting thoughts/ Thank you Roman also.

Hey Marty,

How did you like Photo Mechanic? When I was in Yellowstone, I spoke with a photographer who spoke very highly of it. I have not used a version since a very early one and did not take to it.

James

PS This was a great thread. I am going to pick up CS5 today. :P

Hey Everyone,

I just started using CS5. LOL, I have REALLY been in the dark ages. CS5 is absolutely AMAZING. The Content Aware thing actually works!!! Wow. It is actually kind of scary.

James

I'm a little late to this debate, but I for one absolutely love LR. I use it in conjunction with CS5. I've used Photo Mechanic for several years, but I've mostly phased it out (it's great for reviewing and culling images, but that's about it).

I used to edit images one photo at a time through Photoshop, which would take me about one hour for ten edited photos. Now I use LR to create global adjustments for a series of RAW images. I can do about 100 an hour, and the results are much more consistent since I can see all the images in one place.

I use LR for basic color correction, white balance, tonal and exposure adjustments, dust removal, and light dodging and burning. After that I'll bring the image into CS5 for advanced touch up (Content Aware retouching is AMAZING) and sharpening.

I also just figured out how to use the catalog to organize my entire archive, and it's great. I haven't had any problems using an external HD.

I learned LR through some free online tutorial videos. There are a ton of them out there that you can find with a quick google search.

one thing that has been missed in this discussion and is essential to understand in order to make a rational choice, is what and how do you shoot and what are you trying to accomplish?

Roman likes his style because of what he shoots, Jim the same. You have to look at what you shoot and what you need to accomplish in order to decide what's best. So, if you could describe what it is youre doing and what youre trying to accomplish we could be more help.

Thank you for the comments> I myself like the program. I had to upgtrade to cs5 right away on my new computer, lightroom will be next, I missed the deal on the dual programs hopefully will find another good option for it later.

I find LR faster and easier to use than CS5 for making raw conversions. I use Breezebrowser to review shots following a shooting session, delete the junk, then import to LR. I then rate the ones I want to work on, filter on the rating, then make my changes/emhancements/dust spot removal. Usually this is enough for me. If an image requires adjustments not possible in LR, I bring it into CS5 and go on from there. For publishing to the web, I return to Breezebroswer to 'proof' the images, which usually involves resizing and embedding watermarks (more powerful than LR's watermarking tools). I am not recommending this workflow; it's just the one I use out of years of habit.

I tried Lightroom a few times when they came out with the beta versions and although it is pretty easy to use, I prefer Phase One/ Capture 1 Pro 5 for my raw conversion and the PS CS2 for tweaking the conversion. I am about to upgrade to CS5. I do not however shoot 10k images in a session... more like 700-1,800 and so I do not worry too much about speed. I really like the quality my images end up with with C1 Pro 5.

Very interesting to see how others handle the workflow of several hundred or more photographs. Habit seems a theme here....

Hey Lesley,

That is essentially how I do my processing. Most of the RAW work is done in CO 5 - which I agree provides phenomenal output....quickly. I tweek in CS.

I have been running on the trial version of CS5 which is about to run out. I am trying to find the 'best deal' as Adobe only lets you go back 3 version (i.e. to CS2). I have been debating the purchase of someone's older CS2 so that I can upgrade to 5..but I don't know if that is legit once the software has been registered with Adobe.

James

I have been using CS2 and have thought about upgrading to CS4 or 5 whats the best deal anyone has found.
Thanks randall

I recently went to a smugmug meeting where the guest speaker was Art Suwansang discussing the benefits of Lightroom 3. For the record I'm an Aperture user, I only used the beta version of LR and haven't used it since it was released for sale and currently have CS3. I don't think you can really compare CS#(whichever number) and LR since they are for different tasks and doing different things. CS# is pixel manipulation and LR is image manipulation, metadata, organization, editing and more just as Aperture is. LR and Aperture both allow global manipulations that can be applied to groups of images at once. For instance you want to adjust the white balance for shots taken under the same conditions, just one adjustment and you take care of them all. Same goes for metadata.
Some of the things that did impress me about LR3 is the lens profile, you can correct the barrel distortions from any lens that is in their database. You can also correct for linear distortions without the expense of buying a tilt and shift lens. Additionally the new noise distortion was impressive and I liked the graduated filter feature, much easier than making layers and such in CS.
Since I've started using Aperture I rarely go into CS#, I can do most adjustments to exposure, sharpening, spot removal, color manipulation.... Additionally you never actually change the pixels in either LR or Aperture, both programs simply apply the changes you wish to a version of the image, leaving the master image untouched so there can never be an accidental adjustment to the original. It also saves disk space since you are not saving multiple copies of the same image but just coded instructions of what to do so you can many different versions as you work to see what works best.
You can export easily to various entities, facebook, smugmug, flicker and with Aperture it is easy to apply a watermark to every image as it is exported. I have different export profiles saved that designate size, file type and watermark and I just choose the appropriate one for the selected images, done.
If you do need to do something more complicated both programs export directly to CS# and then save that image as a version back in Aperture/LR when you are done.
I can't even imagine trying to edit in CS, right now I upload, run through assigning number(star) ratings, limit my results and go back through till I have the best then start any needed adjustments.
Sorry this got so long but I'm definitely sold on the benefits of Aperture or LR as tools for image management, editing and the majority of adjustments.
Anyone care to compare Aperture and Lightroom?

Nice post Jenny, that is my impression of LR also. Those that are looking for a good price on Photoshop, I got a discount for one time use on Smugmug for 30% my order, as an upgrade from CS3 it was 172 with tax.

Funny... I just upgraded on Monday to CS5 and I am enjoying it quite a bit. I used that content aware to take out a couple of short poles in an image and it worked fabulously! I am inneed of figuring out Puppet Warp, though now.

Hey Everyone,

So, I have taken a bit of a back door solution to getting CS5. I really did not want a student version for a variety of reasons - mostly in that I am not a student anymore. :P So, I purchased an older OEM CS2 as an upgrade from CS, and the CS5 upgrade. It is definitely a bit bass-ackward, but I hope it will work. :P The total cost came out to about $300 bucks, which I think is worth it.

James

Yeah, that is how you have to play the game. Now if I can find the deal on Light Room.............

I've been lucky to know people with laptops that don't have desktops, since you can do 1 install on each I get the desktop license. Although I've gotten a bit behind and am still on CS3.
With the recent upgrades to Aperture I am using photoshop less and less but it is still needed.